warning in accnt pay

[kimvdh]

I am writing a manual cheque for pay roll
I credit the bank account for the amount of the cheque (net pay) 1110
debit the gross pay 5061
debit the benifits paid 5062
credit the deductions 2215

the debits & credits balance but are higher than the invoice amount so when i got to save it i get a warning - i ignored the warning (after reading other's post on the topic) as soon as i "saved anyway" i got a ERROR box and when i clicked ok on the ERROR box, the pc program closed!
this is what the error said
FRM_APMANUAL.ADDTRANSACTION.RECALCULATETOBALANCE
LINE: 28
ERROR: 5
MESSAGE: Record is out of range

what does that mean? was it ok to ignore the 1st warning?
I will need to make a manual cheque like the above 3xs a month - i need to credit the deductions so that i have something to pay taxes with (cr 1110 db 2215)

[JohnDMeyers]

I'm not the best one to help you with the error, but here's how to handle the benefits:

When writing the cheque,
CR 1110 for the total cheque amount
DB 5061 gross pay
DB 1110 for the same amount as your liability
CR 2215 credit the deductions for the same amount as the line above

That way, the amount of the liability was "put back in" checking.

When you pay off that liability:
CR 1110 checking
DB 2215 deduction liability

There is no expense to the church for the deduction liability. It comes out of the employee's gross pay.

[NeilZ]

I seem to remember that 'record out of range' errors are caused by a bad index. Run a 'reindex' of the system, you'll find this facility under the UTILITIES menu.

If you've got PCPlus networked, make sure everyone is off the system before you do this.

[kimvdh]

John, thanks for letting me know to put the amount of liability back into chequing!
when I CR 1110 the amount on cheque (net pay)
and DB 5061 the Gross salary
and DB 1110 the Deductions
and CR 2215 the Deductions
like you said, then it doesn't balance - the DB is higher than the CR -to make them balance I need to change to CR 1110 to the total gross pay before deductions
then DB 5061 gross salary
DB 1110 total deductions
CR 2215 his deductions
now the DB/CR balance but the amount still doesnt match the invoice amount so i get that warning asking if i wish to continue saving ... is it ok to continue saving even if the invoice amount & DB/CR are out of balance???

(to pay the liability i have to
Cr 1110 (the total amount to remit to CRA from employee & employer)
Db 2215 employee expense (already deducted)
Db 5066 employer expense (a budgeted cost for having employees))

[kimvdh]

Neil,
I don't have a network
which files do I select?
the reference manual says to look in my powerchurch plus folder for a log file... where would i find this folder?

[NeilZ]

Neil,
I don't have a network
which files do I select?
the reference manual says to look in my powerchurch plus folder for a log file... where would i find this folder?

OK no network, great.

You shouldn't need to find a log file to reindex the files, the utility is located under the UTILITIES menu. Just do ALL FILES, the default.

[kimvdh]

Neil,
i did it and it says it was sucsessful! so i guess thats good
re: the file the book says to check it regularly to make sure it is being done and that there aren't any warnings... but i have no idea how to see if the reindexing is a task being done or where to find the reports if they are done?? do you know?

[Zorak]

There is a file called reindex.log in the program directory. By default this is C:\PowerChurch\PCPLUS11 (or whatever version you have). You can find the program directory listed under Help > About PowerChurch Plus. Click on the System Information tab.

The reference you mention in the manual is under a topic called "External reindex utility". This topic explains that you can add the pcindex11 (again, version specific) program to the Scheduled Tasks in Windows, so it runs automatically at a certain time, like midnight, every day. That's why it suggests looking at the reindex.log file to make sure that the scheduled task is happening as it is supposed to, since it is hands-off.

[kimvdh]

thanks Neil!
what about the other warning i got?
CR 1110 to the total gross pay before deductions
DB 5061 gross salary
DB 1110 total deductions
CR 2215 his deductions
the DB/CR balance but the amount still doesnt match the invoice amount so i get that warning asking if i wish to continue saving ... is it ok to continue saving even if the invoice amount & DB/CR are out of balance???

[Zorak]

As long as the amounts in the transaction are correct, it is OK to click through the warning.

Normally, you write a check for $100 and the checking account is credited for $100 and then one or more expense account is debited for a total of $100. The total debits and credits add up to $100, which matches the check amount. When you have a transaction that releases restricted funds, or has multiple sets of debits and credits like your transaction does, then you will see the warning that debits and credits don't match the check amount.

[JohnDMeyers]

... is it ok to continue saving even if the invoice amount & DB/CR are out of balance???

No.


(to pay the liability i have to
Cr 1110 (the total amount to remit to CRA from employee & employer)
Db 2215 employee expense (already deducted)
Db 5066 employer expense (a budgeted cost for having employees))

It's either/or. If you have a liability, you don't need to record it as an expense.

If you pay the employee $253, and the liability is $40, and the employer expense is $55, then the cheque would be $213.

CR 1110 $253 <-employee gross pay gets entered
DB 5061 $253 <-gross wage in expense account
CR 2215 $40 <-set aside liability
DB 1110 $40 <-"subtracts" amount from line 1, employee gets a cheque for $213

CR 1110 $55 employer pays this amount
DB 5066 $55 record expense that the employer pays

[kimvdh]

thanks John
i did what you said with another staff and the amount of the check (invoice amount) still is not matching with the totals for DB/CR -they are balanced tho
amount on manual check $768.84 (for the staff member)
CR 1110 810
DB 5155 810
CR 2216 41.16
DB 1110 41.16
TOTALs 851.16 851.16
the warning is that the invoice amount $768.84 doesnt balance with DB/CR amount 851.16 - i would like to just take the db/cr amounts of 41.16 out and then total db/cr matches the invoice amount but then there is no record of their deductions.... is there a better way?

then i have to write a check to CRA to remitt the amount i deduct from our staff as well as the amount that is the employer's expense the check is for $88.32
CR 1110 88.32
DB 2216 41.16
DB 5156 47.16
TOTALs 88.32 88.32
each employee has a # under their salary because we are hoping to to record the employer's expense for each so we can see total cost of the employee . So 5156 is for what we pay to CRA and 2216 is their remittance money we have taken of their gross pay does that make sense?

[JohnDMeyers]

In part 1 of your question, your Debits and Credits are in balance, but they do not match the amount of your invoice.

Change your invoice amount to $851.16, and you should be all set.

Part 2 of your question. If you want to see the amount per employee, one way is to use sub-accounts for each employee.


Here's how I would do it (using GROUP accounts and Sub-accounts)

In Fund Accounting / Maintain Chart of Accounts
Create GROUP EXPENSE ACCOUNT, 5056-000, Level 4
EMPLOYER EXPENSE

Create Detail expense account Level 6
5056-101 employee #1
5056-102 employee #2


Create GROUP LIABILITY ACCOUNT, 2216-000, Level 4
EMPLOYEE DEDUCTION

Create Detail expense account Level 6
2216-101 employee #1
2216-102 employee #2

[Zorak]

Change your invoice amount to $851.16, and you should be all set.

That doesn't sound right. The actual check amount is $768.84, not $851.16.

The warning that is coming up is not doing the actual debit and credit calculations, it is just adding the debit and credit columns. So if you write a check for $100 that does the following:

cr 1110 $500
db 2110 $100
db 1110 $400

The actual amount of the transaction comes out correct at $100, even though the program is going to pop up a warning and tell you that the check amount is $100 and the total debits and credits are $500.

[kimvdh]

Zorak
soooo you are saying that it is ok to ignore the warning? that what i last posted is a correct way to post?

re:part 2
is my way technically the same as what John is recomending or should i change it all?
i have for employers expenses to CRA
5066-005 employee 1
5076-005 employee 2
5156-005 emplyee 3

i put all the employees deductions into 2216 - i dont need that seperated as it is their expense not ours and it is recorded seperated on a seperate spreadsheet

i like having the employers expense with the salary,benifits etc so that with each subtotal of employee it has every cost to us listed...i think if i do it John's way the employers cost will be seperate from pay & benifit cost???