Move from Fund 01 to Fund 02

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GaboroneBaptist
Posts: 17
Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2017 9:38 am

Move from Fund 01 to Fund 02

Post by GaboroneBaptist »

Our auditors have asked if we could set up a new fund for our reserve accounts (donor restricted funds, donor restricted income, etc). Our transactions are already entered into fund 01 (there are MANY of them for 2015-2017 years). I set up fund 02 for our reserve accounts and selected the GL accounts I need in the new fund. But now I want to move all those transactions from Fund 01 to Fund 02, but still within the same GL account. For example, I need to go from 01-4710-101 to 02-4710-101.

I tried the merge command, but it merges all accounts not selected accounts, and then deletes the old fund.

I want to be able to do a merge on select accounts only.

Can I do that? If not, what can I do to separate the selected transactions into 2 funds?

Thanks, James

NeilZ
Posts: 10209
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 1:20 am
Location: Dexter NM
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Re: Move from Fund 01 to Fund 02

Post by NeilZ »

GaboroneBaptist wrote:Our auditors have asked if we could set up a new fund for our reserve accounts (donor restricted funds, donor restricted income, etc). Our transactions are already entered into fund 01 (there are MANY of them for 2015-2017 years). I set up fund 02 for our reserve accounts and selected the GL accounts I need in the new fund. But now I want to move all those transactions from Fund 01 to Fund 02, but still within the same GL account. For example, I need to go from 01-4710-101 to 02-4710-101.

I tried the merge command, but it merges all accounts not selected accounts, and then deletes the old fund.

I want to be able to do a merge on select accounts only.

Can I do that? If not, what can I do to separate the selected transactions into 2 funds?

Thanks, James
You can't do that easily. What I would do this this:

Don't worry about the old account transactions. That history will remain in Fund 01, and it should. That's where all the checks were written from etc. I'm surprised the auditors told you to move that data, as it will definitely change all the previous years Income and Expenses.

Create the new fund, add the new accounts as needed, then TRANSFER the funds from the 01 accounts to the 02 accounts as of 2018-01-01.

This provides a full audit trail showing the move of the funds to the new fund, and preserves the old data. Any auditor worth their salt will see this as a continuation of the accounts, and will verify the audit trail.
Neil Zampella

Using PC+ since 1999.

GaboroneBaptist
Posts: 17
Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2017 9:38 am

Re: Move from Fund 01 to Fund 02

Post by GaboroneBaptist »

2015 is still open, and this request came from the 2015 audit. Let’s just say we are FAR behind in our accounting but are working hard to get caught up.

There were no checks written from our mission house fund in 2015, only income. In 2016 there was income and one expense (release from restriction). In 2017 there was only income.

So if I go to Jan 2015 and take the monthly income for the mission house and transfer the balance from fund 01 to fund 02, and then repeat for each additional month, would that work?

NeilZ
Posts: 10209
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 1:20 am
Location: Dexter NM
Contact:

Re: Move from Fund 01 to Fund 02

Post by NeilZ »

GaboroneBaptist wrote:2015 is still open, and this request came from the 2015 audit. Let’s just say we are FAR behind in our accounting but are working hard to get caught up.

There were no checks written from our mission house fund in 2015, only income. In 2016 there was income and one expense (release from restriction). In 2017 there was only income.

So if I go to Jan 2015 and take the monthly income for the mission house and transfer the balance from fund 01 to fund 02, and then repeat for each additional month, would that work?
Again, you'll lose the transactions. I would just start with 2018, and answer the audit report with the information that you would lose transaction history and the AUDIT TRAIL if you tried doing anything before 2018. While there was only income in 2015, there are transactions that show where that income was flowing from, same in 2016 and 2017. In 2016, there were expenses, again, you need to retain that data for any future audits, if you try something from 2015, you'll lose all that information.

In any case its really up do you how you want to do it. I would check with your auditors or a friend or church member who's an accounting to see what they think.
Neil Zampella

Using PC+ since 1999.

GaboroneBaptist
Posts: 17
Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2017 9:38 am

Re: Move from Fund 01 to Fund 02

Post by GaboroneBaptist »

The transaction history and audit trail would be on fund 01 for all the transactions already in history. But then what I am asking is doing something like

01/31/2015 01-4710-101 DB 1000.00
01/31/2015 02-4710-101 CR 1000.00
02/28/2015 01-4710-101 DB 750.00
02/28/2015 02-4710-101 CR 750.00

So the fund history and audit trail from the original transactions would still exist in fund 01. In fund 02 all we would see would be the transfers from fund 01. There would still be a trail that goes from 02-4710-101 to 01-4710-101 to the contributions module to the individual contributions/contributors.

So how would I lose the transactions and audit trail in PC since I cannot delete the history of posted transactions? I can talk with our auditors but I need to be explain it to them about how doing balance transfers from one fund to another loses the transactions and audit trail in PC. Our auditors know accounting but they don’t know PC Or how PC creates the audit trail.

Then for 2018, I can set the contributions module to post directly to 02-4710-101 for any income for the mission house.

NeilZ
Posts: 10209
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 1:20 am
Location: Dexter NM
Contact:

Re: Move from Fund 01 to Fund 02

Post by NeilZ »

GaboroneBaptist wrote:The transaction history and audit trail would be on fund 01 for all the transactions already in history. But then what I am asking is doing something like

01/31/2015 01-4710-101 DB 1000.00
01/31/2015 02-4710-101 CR 1000.00
02/28/2015 01-4710-101 DB 750.00
02/28/2015 02-4710-101 CR 750.00

So the fund history and audit trail from the original transactions would still exist in fund 01. In fund 02 all we would see would be the transfers from fund 01. There would still be a trail that goes from 02-4710-101 to 01-4710-101 to the contributions module to the individual contributions/contributors.

So how would I lose the transactions and audit trail in PC since I cannot delete the history of posted transactions? I can talk with our auditors but I need to be explain it to them about how doing balance transfers from one fund to another loses the transactions and audit trail in PC. Our auditors know accounting but they don’t know PC Or how PC creates the audit trail.

Then for 2018, I can set the contributions module to post directly to 02-4710-101 for any income for the mission house.
You can't just do a CR and DB like that, you need to use the TRANSFER accounts as those also update the Net Assets accounts to reflect the transfer of funds.

Also, using the 2015 year is falsifying data. You are NOT transferring funds in 2015, you're doing it in 2018. As I said, just start with the new fund in 2018, based on the few transactions you've told me about, there's not much there for the auditors to complain about.

Again, its up to you what you want to do, but I would NOT backdate such transactions.
Neil Zampella

Using PC+ since 1999.

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